Transforming Business Through Gratitude with Appreciation Advocate Steve Buzogany

Steve Buzogany: 0:00

I actually have six criteria that I use for what a good gift should have. And basically, I'll go real quick through those. The first is the focus, the focus of the gift has to be on the gift or on the receiver, not the giver. So it's not promo, second has got to be a high quality item that won't break or deteriorate or be consumed. It's got to be personalized to the recipient.So something that you could maybe get it engraved with their name on it, get it in their favorite color, whatever it is,it's got to have deep emotional impact, obviously, as was Zig Ziglar, who people buy emotionally justify logically,so you got to connect with the emotions and then five, it's got to have staying power. So it's got to be able to be seen or used regularly so that they think of you just got to build a connection. So it's got to be delivered with like a handwritten note or like a video text or something like that. So people know it's like actually from you and it's actually designated just for them.

Announcer: 0:49

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Jason Muth: 1:13

Welcome to another episode of The Real Estate Law Podcast Jason Muth here along with attorney broker Rory Gill NextHome Titletown Real Estate UrbanVillage Legal in Boston.Rory. Greetings.

Rory Gill: 1:24

Hey, Jason, I just want to let you know that I appreciate all the work that you've done to get that short term rental that you're sitting in ready. It looks great.

Jason Muth: 1:32

I see what you did right there.

Rory Gill: 1:33

I know.

Jason Muth: 1:34

Yeah. We have a guest on today out of Philly.And it is a Steve Buzogany and Steve, and us, we're all going to talk about client appreciation and retention and keeping your current customers super happy. And some ways that he's been able to do that. Steve is are you the CEO of The Appreciation Advocate? Is that what you want to?

Steve Buzogany: 1:55

That's the rumor.

Jason Muth: 1:56

All right. And well,Steve, welcome to the podcast.

Steve Buzogany: 1:59

Yeah, thanks for having me, guys. I'm excited to be here.

Jason Muth: 2:01

But before we hit record, we're talking about Philly a little bit. So Steve,tell everyone where you live in Philly.

Steve Buzogany: 2:07

I'm in the Northwest section called Manayunk. It's where I live.

Jason Muth: 2:11

Manayunk, which is I've been to Manayunk, Rory's been to Manayunk. It's one of the more fun towns or parts of Philadelphia. I think a lot of people outside the area probably don't know how to pronounce Manayunk if they see the word.

Steve Buzogany: 2:22

Yeah, they always have the emphasis on the Y U N K. They go they call it Mana-YUNK, and I'm like dude,No, it's not I say actually the word many. Okay. It's a Native American term and actually means the place we go to drink, which is awesome.

Jason Muth: 2:33

That makes sense because we're Rory and I bought beer in Manayunk. And I actually went - I went to a beer festival, God, 20 something years ago in Manayunk and that was quite a time. They're awesome. So are you Philly native?

Steve Buzogany: 2:46

Yeah, I grew up in northeast Philly. And now I

Jason Muth: 2:49

So I'm not hearing the accent yet.

Steve Buzogany: 2:52

I will come out they'll show. I start talking fast. They'll start seeing yous and water and things like that.live in Northwest Philly.

Jason Muth: 2:58

Oh, there we go there water. Yeah.

Steve Buzogany: 3:01

Yeah, it'll it'll show.

Jason Muth: 3:02

Yeah, I got I got a taste of the Philly accent when I lived in Central Jersey for a couple years after college and you know, split my time,basically in Philly and New York. And it's quite a different accent. You know Philly people Philadelphia people don't think New York is too far away, right?

Steve Buzogany: 3:18

No, I mean it's literally right up the turnpike or the I-95. So it's like, yeah,not a big deal. Like an hour and a half, two hours, something like that?

Jason Muth: 3:25

People from New York and I am originally from New York, we think Philly is a different planet. It is just like, oh, I don't know, it's down there somewhere.

Steve Buzogany: 3:34

Well, I mean,New York is it's kind of its own planet all by itself. I mean,it's not really anywhere, like quite like New York. So it's like, you know, it's almost like when you talk to a New Yorker,once you come down to earth,like the rest of us are.

Jason Muth: 3:44

So tell us about the Appreciation Advocate.

Steve Buzogany: 3:47

started really was because when I started my real estate career as an agent,I had a really, really hard time just like calling people out of the blue and being like, Hey,can I get more referrals? Or hey, are you looking to sell or anything like and you know,approach it and this is probably apply really, really well to like insurance salesman or financial advisor or anybody or even attorneys. Like you don't want to like call through your database and like just like ask him for business. You feel like you need to shower after those phone calls. So it's like, and I really hated it too with real estate like, Hey, are you thinking of selling today? Like yeah, dude, just just today, I just woke up and decided I needed to sell. Like, people don't usually do that. I started doing this I started sending gifts to people kind of like break the ice almost. And I would say is like, Hey, just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate having you in my life and wanted to just call to make sure you got the gift. And then people are like, Oh my God and because it was a nice gift,not like a crap one. It was like, Oh, this was super nice. I wasn't expecting it. Thank you for thinking of me. I can't believe you knew that it was my dog's birthday today or whatever the hell what the story was. And they were like and by the way because they know him in real estate. They were like how's the market and that conversation that question all always gets out how the market and now if that is the organic door open for me to now talk about my business, and then they can then react to that and tell me, Oh,it's crazy, you know, my sister is just thinking about moving fantastic. What's her number?You know, you know, like that kind of and then that's how the conversation has got started.

Jason Muth: 5:16

So sending the gift kind of opens the door to the conversation, even though it's somebody that you have relationship with, right?

Steve Buzogany: 5:23

Yeah, I mean,sometimes not always, sometimes if like, if I was going to do like a for sale by owner type of situation, and I wanted to build a relationship with that person,I might start writing a couple personal notes. And then I'll put together a whole gift, I guess, automation for it after a period of two or three months,and then I can reach out to them without any kind of issue and be like, hey, well, what did you think of one of them, make sure you're getting the gifts I sent you, I saw that you were trying to sell your house by yourself.And it's still on the market, I wanted to make sure you're getting all the items of value I was sending? And they're just like, Yeah, okay. No, I haven't sold it yet. Yes, I haven't getting them. Who are you? And how do I get you over here to take a look at a house? You know, that kind of thing?

Jason Muth: 6:00

Rory, you've sold a house or three? What do you think of this, this process?

Rory Gill: 6:05

I mean it's the whole proposition is seems so simple.And that is you want to maintain relationships with people, and you want to show gratitude. But in effect, it's, it's challenging. And I can't say that, you know, despite my business, this is something I've done very well and very consistently across the board.Makes perfect sense, on a couple of fronts, I can kind of take the next questions in a few different directions. But if we distill it down to just a piece of marketing, even a good gift that cost money is far more effective. And a better return on investment than throwing a ton of money at Facebook, or Google or these kinds of chasing these cold leads. You're really patching up good, solid connections that you already have. So when you talk to people and encourage them to use gift giving, as part of the way they show appreciation, how do the cost factor in?

Steve Buzogany: 7:00

The cost is actually - I have a formula for that. And the cost basically comes out to be five to 10%. And I learned this from John Rulon who wrote the book Giftology I actually, it's five to 10% of your net income is what I use for my gifts. So it, you know,when I close a sale, and it's like, okay, you get it, just to keep numbers, even if it's a$10,000 commission, I'm going to reinvest, you know, $500 to$1,000, into that client over the next 12 months, because they gave me 10 grand to make, or they made me 10 grand this year.So I want to give back 500 to1000. And then that usually ends up in referrals. Plus, you can do some cool things with, you know, let's say you give them four or five gifts over the course of the year, you know,you can do a lot with 125 bucks,or you can do a lot with 100bucks, or whatever it is. And it's like, wow, these are, you know, it's not just like, here's another squishy stress ball with my logo on it, that you're just going to throw in the trash, the second you get it or whatever the heck it is, or, I don't know, whatever other stupid things people give, what bottle openers and things like that,that have just nothing but real estate paraphernalia all over it, or a cutting board that's got REMAX written all over it.And it's just like, you know,that's not really cool, you know? Because it's not about them. And that's and that's that's the big thing that where people screw this up and how people quote unquote,unintentionally poison their best relationships. Because the the unintentional part is you're doing something nice for this person. And you think that it's good, and it's great. And, and this is one of the anchors of appreciation that I talk about.But it's it's called the false positive because the false positive, basically is, all gifts, get the same feedback.The bad ones get the same feedback as the good ones.Because no one when you give people a gift, they're always like, Oh my God, thank you so much. This is this You shouldn't have. And no one's ever gonna say hey, you know what, just you know, this gift. effing sucks.You can take this home, shove it up your you know what, and like,that's, I'm done with this,like, You're a piece of garbage,I can't believe you would ever give me this? Like, no one's gonna say that to you. So basically, what you do is you just, it's a false positive. So now, but you're reinforced that like, Oh my God, my bad gift was great. I should do that again.So and then you keep doing it.So you're now unintentionally poisoning all of your best relationships and you're giving like, you know, that $10,000commission you earn that we talked about earlier, and you give them a $25 gift card.They're like, what's this guy's problem? Are you serious? Like,make 10 grand on me, he sent me20 bucks, you know, 25 bucks.They're gonna like, what a cheap ass like, I can't believe this guy. Yeah, that's where it comes up.

Rory Gill: 9:18

The first kind of category talked about there are I don't even count them as gifts. If it has my logo on it.It's not really a gift. It's swag. And maybe I'll ask you if there's a role for swag,providing that to people as well. What are other categories of just bad gifts that might poison your relationship with your clients?

Steve Buzogany: 9:36

So I actually have a whole list of bad gifts I have a bad gift list. So the swag because just mentioned swag. That's one of the one of the items on there. The problem is when people give their promo and there's gifts. Promo is about the giver gifts are about the receiver. And when people give promo as a gift, like both have a place in business. One is you just have to use them for the right place. And so when they mix the roles up and use promo as a gift. That's where you get screwed up. Because that looks like about you. But like promo to answer your first part of the question, it makes perfect sense. Like, if you are at like a trade show and you are promoting yourself, that's fine.Use promo. If you're at a charity event, and you're a sponsor for the event, you're promoting yourself, fine, that's cool. That's whatever. But if you can just give gifts as one,you know, make it about the giver. So to answer the second part with the bad gifts, like some people say, a good gift or thank you. It's just like writing, write an email and saying thank you in an email,which you know, guys look, thank you emails, nice, but it's not.That's just the end of a transaction. That's not, it's not an actual gesture. Alcohol is a terrible gift in so many different ways. Any kind of food item is a terrible gift because like, I'm gonna make fun of real estate agents because I am one of them. I want to say these things. So basically, the stereotypical real estate agent gift at settlement is a bottle of champagne and maybe like a fruit basket or some kind of crazy, stupid thing like that.So basically what they'll do one thinks one impression, you can't stay top of mind with one impression, too, if it's alcohol, who knows if they're an alcoholic, they have an alcoholic family member, they've been abused by an alcoholic,they have maybe they just don't drink. Or worst of all, what if they're like, I don't know, a champagne connoisseur. And they get this this bottle of champagne that you just bought at the store bottom shelf for 20bucks, they're gonna think what much what a piece of crap this guy is for, you know, he got me dirt, dirt, champagne. So like,you can screw this gift. That's a million ways to screw that one up. I also say events and experiences that are like taking people out to lunch, expensive steak dinners, NBA games,football games, like those are -as nice as they are, they do at the end of the day only make one impression. And like, the example I use is, like if I was getting interviewed by a marketing company to work there,they said are why should we work here and I'd be like, well, it would only cost me like $300 to make one impression, they'd be like, you can get the f out of here. $300 for one impression.We're not hiring your ass, get out here. So and that's another one. So flowers are on there.They they're only like, they last about a week. And then they're gone. You're not top of mind anymore. And then like we were talking about my last one is like the swag bags, the promo items. And then gift cards. And egift cards are just absolute terrible. Nothing says I don't have enough energy to put any time into building a relationship with you better than a gift card.

Jason Muth: 12:14

Well, it's like at the holidays also like you know,when you don't know what to get somebody or you forgot a gift,you get a gift card at the grocery store on the way to the party and then you just give them that gift cards yeah.

Steve Buzogany: 12:23

December is off limits to that's the other thing. If you're trying to stand out. You don't give gifts whenever else given gifts. So eliminate that.

Jason Muth: 12:30

Steve, you're you're kind of completely blowing my mind right now because I can't think of any gifts to give like,what do you give puppies or kittens?

Steve Buzogany: 12:38

No, I mean, so we I actually have six criteria that I use for what a good gift should have. And basically, I'll go real quick through those, the first is the focus, the focus of the gift has to be on the gift or on the receiver, not the giver. So it's not promo, second has got to be a high quality item that's that actually just that won't break or deteriorate or be consumed. It's got to be personalized to the recipient.So something that you could maybe get it engraved with their name on it. Favorite get their get it in their favorite color,whatever it is, it's got to have deep emotional impact,obviously, as what was it Zig Ziglar, who people buy emotionally justify logically,so you got to connect with the emotions. And then five, it's got to have staying power. So it gets if it stays, it's got to be able to be seen or used regularly so that they think of you just got to build a connection. So it's got to be delivered with like a handwritten note or like a video text or something like that. So people know it's like actually from you and it's actually designated just for them. And it's not just some generic thing. So to give you an example. Cutco is a great item for this. Like I used to give my clients you know, scissors, I would give them all pair scissors with their last names engraved on the scissors. And people loved that they thought that was fantastic because it stays it's personalized to them.It's high quality. It's got a lifetime warranty. It goes with the house. They use it all the time. It's probably and it's a very high quality item. I have scissors that are from Cutco.And they're the best scissors I have. I've had them for like eight years. That's one example.I bought people I bought them instead of champagne, instead I would give them a watercolor painting of their house. Again,they can hang it up, they see it every time they walked by. I used to get them cutting boards,but it wasn't about me it wouldn't have like Keller Williams or REMAX inscribed on it would actually have the monogram of their last name,then it would have their actual last name written underneath of it, then it would have the the address of the house they just bought. And then the date of the house, the date they bought the house and that was a big 18 inch by 24 inch piece of wood. I mean it was massive. And so many people would told me afterwards like see, this is the greatest housewarming gift ever. And I'm not going to use this, it's too beautiful. Like I'm gonna hang it up like and they're like this big centerpiece in their kitchen. And they would think of me subconsciously or consciously every time they walked by that thing in their kitchen, which was probably like 18 to 20 times a day. So that's making think about that. That might be like50 to 100 bucks for a cutting board. One you just made a four to five-figure commission you can afford a $$50-$100 cutting board. Second, that's a gift that keeps on giving. I'm making an impression 20 times a day every day forever. Versus, you know, a bottle of champagne, we call that actually a fart in the wind gift, because it's just one impression, and gone.

Rory Gill: 15:15

So the paintings of the house, my sister who's actually a realtor in our office, does that for her seller clients sold a home especially as they're leaving its, you know, token to remember the house that they just sold by. So hopefully that's a, that's a good gift.

Steve Buzogany: 15:31

Yeah, that's good.

Rory Gill: 15:32

But I'm thinking through some of the ones that you said, and I am guilty, I've given the champagne bottle before no judgment, and those are either consumed or they're gone now. And they're forgotten.I want to run a couple of gifts by you and get your impression.And be brutally honest, if these are good or bad.

Steve Buzogany: 15:48

I'll give you the Philly honesty.

Rory Gill: 15:51

For clients, usually buyer our clients, when they're moving to new neighborhood or town, I will go out and seek glassware or I've done pillows,things from that are embroidered with the name of the town or something that's kind of like welcoming them to the town.

Steve Buzogany: 16:05

That's cool

Rory Gill: 16:05

And glassware is particularly good or not. Yeah,that can chip.

Steve Buzogany: 16:10

Yeah, I do that I've actually given clients like past clients, after they bought their house, obviously, I tell them at settlement, hey, I come with a house and they know that they're, they expect to hear from me afterwards. So when I find out that they have, a lot of times they'll buy houses unmarried, and then they'll get married later. And I find out when their wedding is and they tell me oh, we're getting married or I get an invitation or whatever, I actually will buy them champagne flutes with their names engraved on it. And one will say like the date of their marriage of their wedding, and it will have you know, groom his name and bride her name. And that way they'll there's almost like, and I make sure that they're delivered before the wedding. So they can actually like bring it to the wedding and use it them. So I do that,basically. And that's obviously something they'll keep forever.So that yeah, glassware is great, as long as it's got a cool story to it.

Rory Gill: 17:18

I mean, that actually raises a good question here. And something that I haven't considered a lot of realtors,like myself give the gift at the time of settlement or just around the settlement. And that's often kind of the end of the story. There may be some minor follow up. But what you're suggesting is actually take your gift giving budget and stretch it out over the course of at least a year. And as you say that that makes a ton of sense to kind of use it to continue the relationship down the line.Is that the timeline your use?Or how do you space out the gifts, what are some good strategy is for when you give the gifts to the clients,

Steve Buzogany: 17:52

When is basically anytime they're least expecting it. So not December,and then basically any other random day. So like, today,April 6, will be a really random gift. So you could do that. And then so like pick random days during the year when people aren't expecting gifts. And when this shows up with a handwritten note from you, personalized to them. It's like wow, this is really cool. Like, the middle of July would be another random time or I don't know, October14, something, some obscure date that no one's expecting it,that's the best time and then use those and then split it out.So it depends on the commission size too. Like, if it's a million dollar client, like and it's usually like a $20,000commission, it's like, Alright,maybe we stretch this out, maybe make these gifts, higher quality, higher quality,whatever else you can do, I mean, maybe two years, three years, but I tried to stay and then declined parties to like I mean, I do all that stuff, just to keep in touch with people, I just, it's just you just want to make sure that you're staying top of mind and that and that's actually what I'm actually starting and this is one of my new projects that I'm doing is I'm uh I'm actually starting a new group on how to do this and not charging for it at all. So for realtors who are doing that we can, by the end, when we give our videos and stuff or information, I'll tell people how to get into the get into that group.

Jason Muth: 19:02

Are you starting a Facebook group? Is that what you have here recently? Yeah,Mastermind course.

Steve Buzogany: 19:06

It's basically what I'm going to be doing. So a little insight into how I am. So I have over the course of my career, I have spent probably around like $100,000 over the course of my career, in like coaching and stuff like that,and I cannot stand the prices of some of these coaches and like,I don't know how many times I've been told to pay $5,000+ for a coaching program, get no service afterwards and then have no money left over to actually use the coaching knowledge I have on the database I want to use it on, and that really pisses me off like like, boils my blood man. It's like losing the Dallas Cowboys. It's the worst feeling ever.

Jason Muth: 19:42

So I could tell you yeah, that's terrible. I'm a Giants fan and a Patriots fan.But a Giants fan by heart and we hate the Cowboys.

Steve Buzogany: 19:50

Yeah everyone does. They're a terrible team.So anyway, let's bring it back.I can't I drives me insane. So basically what I'm doing is I'm building a beta program here where people who are in a service based industry like attorneys, accountants,realtors, insurance, people, all those kinds of jobs, basically join my beta program and for free and then if that if they want to become members long term, I'm just going to charge a low monthly fee. I'm talking like less than 100 bucks, maybe less than maybe less than 50bucks honestly, because I want to be able to get more professionals in this kind of mindset. And I allow them to one, get the material, the knowledge, and then have money leftover to use that on their business, not paying me a ridiculous fee where they're broke afterwards. And then they have no service afterwards and basically treat them the way I treat my clients, these these new members. So that's the whole goal here. That's the newest project I'm working on.

Jason Muth: 20:44

Yeah, I think people need coaching with this.Because, you know, my guess is people give the bottle of champagne. And that's it, or they give nothing, and they think nothing down the line3-6-12 months into it. It sounds as though you probably have a CRM system or something that maybe gives you cues or indications that it's time to send a gift to Rory Gill or to Jason Muth there's nothing,

Steve Buzogany: 21:06

Yeah, I actually have all kinds of different right?styles, multiple CRMs, ones for client contact, and others for gifting contact, and all kinds of different stuff. And that's actually stuff that's going to be in that that course, is like putting all of my resources out there, like this is how you do this systematically. So you don't have to think about it.Because honestly, I have 250clients, I don't have time to remember all their birthdays, I don't have time to write 250notes a day, or I have like two or three birthdays every day, I don't have time to write them.So I have to be responsible and not forget them and put that birthday together. And then I just add another contact. And I also do half birthdays. So there's that too. So there's another 250 contacts I got to do. So it's just like, if you don't have a system for this stuff, if you really do care about your database, you'll put a system in place to make sure they aren't forgotten.

Jason Muth: 21:52

Now, do people tend to expect gifts from you? And then when they stopped coming,is that a bummer?

Steve Buzogany: 21:59

No, because I spaced them out like I usually don't, I don't do more than four gifts a year for a client.Because I don't want one, I don't want it to demean the meaning of the gift where it's just like, hey, I'm just giving you another gift, another gift another gift. I want it to just be like more of a bigger impact gift once or one to four times a year. And they're just like,wow, this is so cool. And like because they're the method I call it I call it attacking the kitchen. Because everything I give people are usually in the kitchen so that they use it frequently. They spend the most time there and they're usually storyboard pieces to where like people are like wow, that's a really cool cutting board thing's huge. Who made that for you? Where did you get it? Oh,my real are getting it. Oh, what about the ice cream scooper? My realtor gave me that. This nice pair of scissors, these knives,these, the pizza cutters,everything that they use that everything they touch in their kitchen, they're always thinking of me. So that's why it's like there's subconsciously being reminded me like oh my god, my realtor first in my kitchen.

Jason Muth: 22:50

It's a bit of a different way to think about promo items. And you know, I've received many promo items over the years, you know, both swag at conferences and gifts.

Steve Buzogany: 22:58

Where are they?

Jason Muth: 22:59

Well at my last, so Rory knows some of my favorite promo items that I do use all the time. And they are branded Yeti mugs.

Steve Buzogany: 23:06

Okay

Jason Muth: 23:07

And I love them. I mean, I there was a digital vendor that I worked with, in my old job where they sent me a couple of these Yeti mugs, I didn't realize I was supposed to distribute them to my team. So I kept them all because I'm like,Oh my God, all these great Yeti mugs. I passed a couple at once I once I realized my error there. And that same company sent me a really cool like North Face backpack or something which I use to this day. And I think I use it because they if their logo was more branded on it, I wouldn't use it. But their logo is embroidered in black along with the black backpack. So it's not really you know, subtle,prominent. Yeah, it's very subtle. And, you know, I think those are both great promo items, because when they showed up, and they were, I think Christmas gifts. But when they showed up, they were very usable. I mean, those had direct utility to like what I want to do in my life everyday, like I want a cup of coffee in the morning, and want to stay warm for a long period of time, not like 10 minutes in this ceramic mug. So you know, I do think those are okay, and I'm okay with them putting their logo on it. In fact, I had a one of the credit unions that I closed with, I think actually it's for the loan for the property I'm sitting in right now. They sent me branded Yeti mugs as well.And I don't mind I'm proud to show their logo off when I'm drinking out of the mug because,hey, I had a great experience.

Steve Buzogany: 24:18

Yeah, yeah. And that's good. And most people aren't like that. I have mortgage people who have thrown themselves like mind, body and soul at me with just nothing but like, you know, there's Wells Fargo and cross country mortgage and everybody, any lender you can think of I've gotten swag out the wazoo as a realtor just thrown at me. And it's just like, I don't have anything in here anymore. I just throw it away. Because it's just and they are one I don't drink coffee. So unlike you Jason i I have no purpose for Yeti mugs, other than maybe like a beer. But outside of that. But I mean,Yeti is a good, that's the other thing getting is a great product. So like that's even with the brand on it. It's like,you know, you can still make that work. It's a really nice product and regardless of what's on it. So I'm just saying it really, all of those six rules I gave you guys earlier, what makes a great gift. Those are like 90 to 95% of time. Like that's not always the case. Like once in a while it is okay to give food or once in a while it's okay to give a special bourbon or whatever like I mean,it's very situational and this is where emotional intelligence comes in. And so like you just got to know and like, Well, like I was talking I was I was actually with I went out to lunch with a lender of mine today. And he showed me that his one friend is a bourbon extraordinaire of some kind. He has $300,000 worth of bourbon in his house. He has a secret room in his home behind a bookcase that opens up into this big bourbon room. And I'm like,Whoa, so like, that's like the coolest thing ever. Obviously,Bourbon would be a fantastic gift. If you're prepared to spend $4,000 on a bottle of bourbon for this guy, because obviously wouldn't be a good gift anywhere else.

Jason Muth: 25:52

And that's tough if he's branded as the bourbon guy with $300,000 worth of bourbon.Yeah, inclination is to give something bourbon related but he probably has it already. Right?

Unknown: 26:02

He might. He might so then then then maybe what you don't use what you do is it might be you know, not the bourbon itself, maybe something that you consume the with. So like, I know, like that John Ruhlin who wrote Giftology, like I told you like, he has a couple of wine connoisseurs in his database. And he what he would do is he would spend like two to$300 on a wine bottle opener engraved with the the person's name on it and stuff like that,and get them this really cool thing. And he said that apparently a lot of his clients when they would travel, they use that wine bottle opener, because it's what their name and it's high quality, it's expensive.And it's that's the tool they use to go through despite the fact that they're a wine connoisseur. They've got all the wine they need. But that's the tool they use, like, you know,that's a way to, it's a tangible item they use off and they see it off, and it's personalized to them high quality like these are he's hitting all the boxes.

Jason Muth: 26:49

Yeah. You know,before we get to the final couple of questions, I have a question about experiences.Because you know, the last place I worked, we were big on experiences giving out concert tickets, sporting event tickets,we had a box at the TD Garden and Gillette Stadium. And people love that stuff. I mean, no,you're in a sports town. Also,Philly's is a huge sports town,just like Boston

Steve Buzogany: 27:09

The sports town.

Jason Muth: 27:10

Well.

Steve Buzogany: 27:12

We can get into this right now.

Jason Muth: 27:15

That's a whole separate podcast. Talk about tickets for things and talk about events. Because you did allude to it earlier about having a client appreciation event earlier, what do you do,do you because when you're doing tickets for an event, oftentimes you're accompanying the person that you're bringing to the event, just so you can get a little bit of FaceTime with them. And, you know, but then you're bringing yourself into that conversation. Whereas a lot of the items that you have in a kitchen, they're suddenly thinking about you, but you're not standing there cutting cheese and opening wine with them when they're doing it. So talk a bit about events, and how that kind of factors into what you're thinking,

Steve Buzogany: 27:47

Yeah, for me, I don't usually take one person out to an event. So like, when I had a client party, one time, I took them to the Phillies, we got a I got a box seat, or not box, either box, or full box for like 40 people. And they got the whole special treatment I took40 of my best clients out. And I got spend time with 40 people at one time, rather than rather than go one time with one person and spend that money and spend that time. And it's not because I don't love that one person,it's just, I'm trying to be as efficient with my time as I can.I'm also trying to get as much face time as I can. So I can get face time with 40 people at one time, and have a good time with them. And then give them something afterwards for them to remember versus you know, just going out with one person one time and making one impression because no offense to the Phillies or to that person is the next morning when they wake up. They're probably not gonna be thinking about it or whatever. It's just a Phillies game. I mean, there's 100 and whatever, 180 of those a year.So it's like, you know what, I know how many games are in the MLB I don't follow.

Jason Muth: 28:41

Well, there's, well,there's 162. But you're optimistic thinking you're gonna make the playoffs. That's what you're adding on there.

Steve Buzogany: 28:47

We were in the World Series. I don't remember,where were you guys?

Jason Muth: 28:51

When the Red Sox aren't in World Series, people from Boston kind of tune out.They're like, Oh, that's not the Red Sox.

Steve Buzogany: 28:56

Yeah. So basically, we're bigger 160games like a Phillies game. It's just like, whatever. Like, you know, they they wake or same with the Sixers. Like they play eight some games a year. And it's like, oh, it was like the Sixers game last night. Okay,cool, whatever. But like, they wake up the next day, and like they're on to the next thing.They're not gonna they're not gonna like rant and rave about this one Phillies game, or this one Sixers game or Flyers game,or you're even the Eagles games,like, for the next month that just like, like, that's it.Unless it's like this prolific,like the only thing like for me,I've been to a ton of Eagles games. And when they won against the Vikings in the NFC Championship before they won the Super Bowl against the Patriots,I think it was, it was like. You like that dig, by the way? So basically, that NFC Championship game was phenomenal. And I'll never forget that. So like that's a different type of event. Like maybe like, but then again, it is still one impression, you know what I mean? So it's just like you got to, it's a fine line to walk there. And it's very situational. So like, my thing is if you really absolutely have to try to bring as many people as you can to get as much FaceTime as you can, and then make sure there's a gift to go with it afterwards so that there's you know, something that it's not that you basically quote unquote go home with them.You know what I mean? Like don't just like leave it at the event and then they forget about you the next morning when they wake up and go to work, or whatever the situation is.

Jason Muth: 30:53

Yeah. Is it the Nick Foles Super Bowl?

Steve Buzogany: 30:56

That was that was yeah.

Jason Muth: 30:58

Once you said that you lost me afterwards. Rory,any final thoughts before we get to our final three questions that we ask of all our guests.

Rory Gill: 31:07

No, I just have one thought here. And that is if somebody is listening and they kind of embrace this message and they want to jump into it, is there a way to tastefully use thoughtful gift giving to reactivate some older leads? I mean, if you started with good habits with a new client that you have today, you can obviously implement this going forward. But is there a tasteful way to kind of reactivate more stale people in your network?

Steve Buzogany: 31:29

Yeah, so I actually did this, what I used to do was, I would hold my, I would actually create some accountability. And what I would do is I would send an email or a text or a call or a video text,however you do it, did you like,hey, look, as a past client of mine, and someone who I really appreciate for trusting me with your home sale or home purchase whatever it was, I wanted to let you know that I do sincerely appreciate your business and your trust in the past. So going forward over the next 12 months or a year, I'm going to be reaching out to you giving you a certain gift or whatever, not going to tell you what they are.But you got some surprises coming in here, courtesy of your real estate agent looking forward to having some fun this year. And that when they like,expect it when these things start showing off. It's not like, What the hell is this?Like? What is this out of the blue crap? It's more like, the responses I got. I was like, oh,you know what I didn't, you know, he said he was gonna do this. And here he is doing it.And it was it was more received that way. It was more open. And people weren't like, what's he?What's he doing? Like? It wasn't nobody who had an idea, because I explained it to them, like,Hey, I got some surprises coming your way this year. So be ready for them. Thanks, again, for your trust and your business.And you know, by the way, if you have a family member or friend moving, please don't keep me a secret. You know, that's a whole thing.

Jason Muth: 32:40

Well, it is so much easier to retain clients than it is to get new ones. So yeah. So such such great advice that you've been giving, you know,not just appreciation, but gift giving and being thoughtful toward others. And it's genuine too. You know, it doesn't.Everything you've said doesn't come across as swarmy it comes across as you know, I was thinking of you. Yeah. So Steve,why don't we get to our final three questions, we ask these of all of our guests in the podcast just to wrap things up and get to know you a little bit better.The first of these, if you can get on stage for half an hour and talk about any subject in the world with zero preparation.What would that be?

Unknown: 33:14

Probably this appreciation stuff. I probably go right into talking about the three anchors of appreciation and how they really screw people up.

Jason Muth: 33:24

Not the Eagles?

Steve Buzogany: 33:25

No, I don't want some of the Eagles. Freakin lose the Super Bowl.

Jason Muth: 33:29

Well, I mean, come on. Like they weren't gonna win that game. You really thought they were?

Steve Buzogany: 33:33

Yes.

Jason Muth: 33:34

Wow.

Steve Buzogany: 33:35

Yes I was, I'm heartbroken. Pat Mahomes running down the field on one leg. Like who saw that coming?

Jason Muth: 33:42

The rest of the country? But no, that's okay.

Steve Buzogany: 33:46

I'm jaded then.

Jason Muth: 33:48

Second question,tell us something that happened early in your life or career that impacts the way that you're working today.

Steve Buzogany: 33:54

Early in my career, I was exposed to like I was mentioned before John Ruhlin a couple of times and I was exposed to his book and that was mind blowing the Giftology was awesome. And I consider my on my Mount Rushmore of mentors. The four people that are on there,John Ruhlin is one of them. One of the others is Brian Buffini.And he's a real estate teacher and coach as well. And I basically have built my career,basically mixing the two of those together. And I've built because Brian Buffini does, like pop bys and stuff like that. But those things very often are one impression type things like, you know, giving like a bag here,back there. And it's just like I don't want and it's also not really time efficient, like to go down and pop by the 250clients of mine is not great.Which it's great to get the face time. But I don't have that that kind of time, especially with two kids under three years old and two Bernese Mountain dogs,it's just like impossible to get out and do anything at this point. So I I liked the John Ruhlin approach there where it's like, give the gift and leave the impression to stay there.And you know, the Buffini real estate processes, like basically just mixing those two together is basically where I got it. And being exposed to those guys.Basically, in the first six months of my career was like phenomenal. Yeah, that was just like, Wow, thank God I met them so early.

Jason Muth: 35:07

Rory, do you know that book gift is a Giftology?

Rory Gill: 35:09

Yep, yeah. I, I've read that book.

Steve Buzogany: 35:11

It's phenomenal.Yes.

Jason Muth: 35:14

Final question we have for you. I mean, that might be your answer for this one. But it is tell us something that you're watching or reading or listening to these days.

Steve Buzogany: 35:22

I don't watch a whole lot of TV. I'll be honest with you. So I do like the Mandalorian though. So reading,not really reading anything at the moment. I do a lot of podcast listening now. So because I saw I fall asleep during reading, and I really,and I really, I don't I just do audiobooks and podcasts,honestly, so I think yeah, stuff like that.

Jason Muth: 35:44

Do you regulate TV time with the kids?

Unknown: 35:47

We do. We only let them watch TV on Friday when they're home from daycare and and then the only time outside of that like on the weekends as if we actually go out to eat. Like if we're going out to a restaurant and my two and a half year old.It's like he's just unplugged.So like I have to like anchor him down with a cell phone. for like an hour, and it's fine,because outside of that, then it's like, alright, we got two Bernese Mountain dogs, go ride the dogs around, they're big enough that they can handle you,like put a saddle on them and run around or something, you know, build these blocks or whatever. But yeah, I do want them to grow up, like, you know,being able to make eye contact and shake hands and engage with humanity versus, you know, being stuck in a phone.

Jason Muth: 36:26

I won't comment about how much TV time we allow our daughter, but

Steve Buzogany: 36:29

That's fine. I'm not gonna judge you. Your daughter is probably older than my kids. You probably

Jason Muth: 36:35

No she'll be four.She'll be four next month and the first The first year was a pandemic, basically.

Steve Buzogany: 36:41

So that's a totally different year.

Jason Muth: 36:42

Yeah. I mean

Steve Buzogany: 36:43

You don't get to go anywhere in that.

Jason Muth: 36:45

No, we relied on the Cocomelon a lot like during that first year. But yeah, she watches a good amount of TV, but she's at daycare all day and she's not exposed to TV during the day. And Rory, I think she's pretty well socialized. Right.Like she's doing well with chatting with friends and hanging out.

Rory Gill: 37:00

She's not, she's not shy of people. So yeah not too worried about that.

Jason Muth: 37:05

Yeah. But yeah, but you, you definitely would judge us if you saw how much TV she watched.

Steve Buzogany: 37:09

I'm not a judging really doing this thing.And parenthood is there's no perfect art. There's just what was it Cesar Milan said, there's not a perfect way to raise a dog. There's what I do is just a way to do it. And I think that's what parenthood is, too. It's just not a perfect way to do it.There's just many different ways to do it.

Jason Muth: 37:25

Yes, we need a parent whisperer, just like

Steve Buzogany: 37:28

A human whisperer.Cesar

Jason Muth: 37:32

So Steve, tell we're gonna put all this stuff in the show notes where people could find you. But what's the easiest way to get a hold of you? If people have more questions,

Steve Buzogany: 37:39

the best way is just to reach out and send me an email. I do check that the most.And it's the easiest way to get in touch with me and I do pay attention to it. And I try to respond to every email, believe it or not, even the ones that are spamming, I would say that you can just send me an email at steve@appreciationadvocate.com And that's, that's basically it.And if anybody does want to jump into that data that I'm starting, you know, opt in and it's free. And you get to do this kind of stuff.

Jason Muth: 38:03

Everyone loves free.Everyone loves gifts. Everyone loves people love swag, too.It's amazing how much people take free stuff off of tables at things, you know, imagine being actually good swag. Yes, Rory,where can people find you?

Rory Gill: 38:16

You can find me either at my brokerage NextHome Titletown Real Estate,nexthometitletown.com Or my law practice UrbanVillage Legal, UrbanVillagelegal.com.

Jason Muth: 38:26

All right. And if you've enjoyed this episode,we'd love it if you can give us a five star review. You don't have to send us gifts. But that will be your gift to us. Where you can give us a comment or you can shoot me a message or if you want to be on the podcast, email me, jason@nexthometitletown.com.And we will try to get you scheduled. So Steve Bizogany just like mahogany, right?

Steve Buzogany: 38:48

Yes.

Jason Muth: 38:50

It's been a pleasure talking to you. The Appreciation Advocate is your website, your business, wishing you much success throughout the greater Philadelphia area in your professional world, not necessarily in the sporting world. But you know, that's,that's a whole different podcast.

Steve Buzogany: 39:05

Okay, we'll get there one day.

Jason Muth: 39:06

We'll get there one day, Steve, thank you so much for being here. This has been a really enlightening conversation about a topic that seems so basic, which is gift giving and being thoughtful toward others and being thoughtful toward your clients. And we definitely have not dug into this in the past on The Real Estate Law Podcast. So you know, you are our foremost expert on appreciation and gift giving it we'll have to have you back in the future.

Steve Buzogany: 39:26

Yeah, happy to be back then you guys are blast to talk to, and a lot of fun to shoot the you know what with.

Jason Muth: 39:32

All right. I'll end on that compliment, so thanks.Thanks, everyone.

Announcer: 39:39

This has been The Real Estate Law Podcast. Because real estate is more than just pretty pictures. And law goes well beyond the paperwork and courtroom arguments. were powered by NextHome Titletown Real Estate or Boston's progressive real estate brokerage. More at nexthometitletown.com and UrbanVillage Legal,Massachusetts real estate council serving savvy property owners, lenders and investors.More at UrbanVillage legal.com.Today's conversation was not legal advice, but we hope you found it entertaining and informative. Discover more at realestatelawpodcast.com. Thank you for listening