Real Estate Rebates for Our Heroes: A Conversation with Heroes Home Advantage CEO David Cain

David Cain: 0:00

The key is we're looking for the right partners. We're looking for people who have a servant's heart, who are wanting to give back who are interested in growing and building a sustainable business through reaching heroes. So we're not looking for just anybody. We're looking for the right people with the same approach and vision and heart that we do as a program.

Announcer: 0:28

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Jason Muth: 0:52

Welcome to The Real Estate Law Podcast. Hello, hello. Hello, thank you again for joining us Jason Muth here, along with real estate broker real estate attorney Rory Gill coming to us from the Boston office in South Boston today. Rory, we're recording this right before St. Patrick's Day. Is the neighborhood humming?

Rory Gill: 1:11

It's the calm before the storm right now just had a little bit of bad weather the past couple of days, but it's gonna spring to life. And the next couple. I'm excited for today's podcast. And it's a really practical one for a lot of the realtor listeners, real estate attorney listeners and everybody here because we're always looking for something to add to our toolkit to help serve our clients better. And in this episode, we'll be talking about a valuable program that you can use to help your your military buyers.

Jason Muth: 1:38

Yes, not just military, first responders and everything. And we'll have David talk about that. But let's welcome to the podcast. This is David Kane. He is the CEO and chief hero evangelist of Heroes Home Advantage. David, welcome to the podcast.

David Cain: 1:51

Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate the two of you super excited about today.

Jason Muth: 1:57

Awesome. Well, you know, we've been in discussion with you and your team for a number of months now to get you on the podcast. So we're very excited to hear about Heroes Home Advantage, some of the great work that you've done over the years that you've been operating, you know. Learn about why you did it while you're doing it. You know what the benefits are to all of the first responders and military folks who are beneficiaries of the service you're providing and then how this could help out with lead generation and goodwill for all the realtors and other people in the real estate nd law communities that you work with. So first, I should ask Where are you right now? Where are you coming from?

David Cain: 2:34

I'm actually in Columbia, South Carolina, home of the Gamecocks.

Jason Muth: 2:38

All right, did they make the tournament this year? Or no?

David Cain: 2:41

No. Little rough year rebuilding first year of a new coach. So maybe next year?

Jason Muth: 2:47

Yeah, I'm such a non basketball person for some reason. But I know that you know, in your part of the country, the Carolinas I mean, basketball is, you know, it goes like church and basketball, I think in some in some people's minds.

David Cain: 2:59

Oh, yeah. And football.

Jason Muth: 3:00

So and football. Yeah, well, we're big football. But we're a pro, you know, up here in New England. You know, we're, you know, God bless all the college teams up here. But they're nothing like you know, the SEC and Big 10 all those places. So David, tell us a little bit about Heroes Home Advantage, like, you know, when did you found this organization? Why did you do it? And what are some of the things that you've learned along the way?

David Cain: 3:20

Absolutely. So great questions. Heroes Home Advantage was started 12 years ago, by a actually a realtor named Michelle Ladd, out of Rochester, New York, she was looking at looking for a way to give back. And she had a long history of people in the military health care and a couple other a couple other hero categories. And she was just interested in giving back and serving these people. The last couple of years, she has kind of gone a little bit different direction towards some nonprofits that she has. And I took over the program last year, we've made a lot of changes that I think are going to be very, very beneficial for the partners for our heroes. And so we're super, super excited about the growth that we've had, and the future of the program. Over the last 12 years, we have given back over $20 million to our heroes. So we're super, super proud of that.

Jason Muth: 4:25

Were you a participant of the program before you took it over recently?

David Cain: 4:29

No, I was not. I had reached out to her just trying to learn about the program potentially becoming a partner. And we developed a relationship and realized we had a lot of synergy and a lot of similar views. And so last year, she knew that she was going to go a little bit different direction. So I purchased the program from her and I'm super excited about just the program the ability to give and serve others that serve us well.

Jason Muth: 5:03

So first responders are a category that are on, it's been on everyone's mind for recently, you know, through COVID. And, you know, we've been through a number of military conflicts. And, you know, I think we all have first responders in our lives, whether they're serving overseas or serving in the communities in which we live. What are some of the things that you've learned in working with this community? Are there any unique, not just benefits, but any unique situations where people that are part of the program have given back to their communities or have benefited themselves as a result of working with Heroes Home Advantage?

Unknown: 5:38

Yeah. So, you know, there's five different hero categories. And so there's military, police, fire, health care, and education. And so all of these categories, they give so much they sacrifice, you know, their time, their energy, you know, time away from family. And so it's just been really satisfying to give back. I've got family or friends, it's in pretty much every category. My sister is a teacher. There was a time 10 or 15 years ago, I was going through a rough patch in my life, she saw I'd actually moved in with her. And she was a school teacher, as I mentioned earlier, she'd get up every morning, you know, five o'clock, 5:15, you know, get ready to go to school, and she would, you know, get home around, you know, three, four or five o'clock she'd fix dinner. And once dinner was over, then she would be back grading papers, you know, homework, she had worked till, you know, 10 o'clock at night. And yes, I didn't expect that. You know, just seeing that sacrifice that, that all of these people give, one of the motivations is just to give back.

Jason Muth: 6:58

Yeah, these folks are giving a lot of their time, a lot of their lives, it's time away from their family, if they're, you know, serving somewhere that's not where they can go home at night. Many, many hours, early mornings, late nights. What does the giving back involve? You know, you mentioned $20 million, has been given back to our heroes as part of the program. Why don't you talk a little bit about how those rebates occur. And what qualifies, I mean, people are qualified if they are one of the hero categories. But how did they get signed up with a program like this?

David Cain: 7:28

Yes. So the way it works is we've got partners, whether it be realtors, lenders, or attorneys, who are willing to give back a portion of their commission when our heroes buy or sell real estate. The key point is that the heroes need to start with us, because we need to connect them with our network. Because not every person in those three categories the realtor, the lender, or the attorney or title company, is willing to give a portion of their commission. And so we need to make sure that they are connected with our network of people that are willing to give back. And so you know, the realtor typically, well, the realtor does give, it's a 25% referral back to the hero, the lender gives up to $500 or the cost of the appraisal, and the attorney or title company gives up to $250. And so when you combine it all together, it's a significant amount of money that's going back to the hero, and it goes to the hero at closing, which is unique, because most programs are not giving it back to the hero at closing. And to my knowledge, we are the highest percentage of the amount that goes back to the hero of any program in the country.

Rory Gill: 8:53

Now I have to ask you, I guess my job here is to get into the nitty gritty and the details. But does this does this rebate program interfere at all with VA loans or other benefits that these these heroes may have?

David Cain: 9:06

No great question. So this goes with any program because it's not a loan program. It is a credit that's given by all the parties that are involved in the transaction. So whether they're going with an FHA loan, conventional loan, VA loan, USDA loan, this can go with any program because it's not a loan program. Everybody that's a part of our network is giving back a portion of their commission to the hero.

Rory Gill: 9:36

Especially with even though heroes on the homefront, teachers and people working in our communities, across the country we're facing, you know, home affordability, mobility issues that are really driving out a lot of the people we really need to hold our communities together. Can you speak a little bit about what this means to to those heroes when you know when they make the most expensive purchase of their lives? They just get a little bit of relief from all this upfront costs.

David Cain: 10:00

Absolutely. So, you know, as we mentioned earlier, these people are sacrificing so much already, whether it's deployments or work in third shifts at the hospital, you know, being away from their families, you know, all kinds of sacrifices for us. And in these professions, they're not doing it for money, they're doing it to make a difference. And so, you know, their bank accounts typically aren't flush with cash, they don't have plenty of money for down payment or closing costs. And so this is extremely valuable to these people, in some cases, and makes a difference of whether they become homeowners or whether they continue to rent. Because it could be, you know, up to $5,000 or more, depending on the purchase price that's basically given that to them to pay their closing costs. So it's a huge, huge difference, and has a big impact on on all of these hero categories. And it definitely helps with home affordability, as you mentioned, which is becoming a big issue.

Jason Muth: 11:04

Can you tell us a little bit about the network, because I'm looking on your website, and you know, there's probably about 100 or so dots on the map of the United States, I'm seeing a lot of concentrated in the southeast. And in the northeast, actually, throughout Pennsylvania, Delaware, upstate New York, and then Carolinas down to Florida. Looks like you have a handful around Chicago, and then it goes west. And, you know, US maps are always well, the US map is always so deceiving, because there's such a small population in large parts of the country, you know, so we tend to see lots of dots around the large metropolitan areas for whatever type of map you're looking at, if it's McDonald's, or coffee spots, or you guys, but have you noticed a greater adoption or more success in certain parts of the country? Are you looking to grow in specific parts of the country? Like talk a little bit about your footprint?

David Cain: 12:17

Yeah, absolutely. So right now we are in the process of expansion, we are looking for partners that can help our heroes. We're doing massive branding and marketing campaigns and things to increase awareness about our program and just try to reach more heroes because more heroes need to know about what we're offering. Because obviously, I'm biased, but in my opinion, is the best program in the country. And so we are looking for more partners. So that is something that is a focus of ours. Absolutely. We love to talk to anybody that's willing to give back. The key is we're looking for the right partners, we're looking for people who have a servant's heart, who are wanting to give back who are interested in growing and building a sustainable business through reaching heroes. So we're not looking for just anybody, we're looking for the right people with the same approach and vision and heart that we do as a program.

Rory Gill: 13:23

I know a lot of people in these professions are looking for genuine ways to give back to the community. It's not just about money for for everybody, what are some reasons that people in these professions should really consider partnering with you?

David Cain: 13:36

Well I think it's really just the core of who we are, is because we give back at a higher percentage than any program in the country. They hopefully know what our real intention is. And it is about giving back. Now, we are going to be branding and doing marketing campaigns, more podcasts, like like yours. And so we want to partner with our partners to grow their business. This is not a hey, come join us. And we'll see you next year, when it's when it's due. I give every single partner my cell phone number. And we also have a weekly partner success call. That's optional, but we do offer it to everybody. We also offer a money back guarantee if they do not for X their investment. So we are here, not as a program to just benefit ourselves. We're here to help our partners reach heroes. And as I mentioned, build a long term sustainable business by giving back to our heroes.

Jason Muth: 14:55

So the model when you're working with a partner, when you identify the right partner, it sounds like there's more than just a rebate that they're giving off of their commission. Is there some kind of upfront fees or monthly fees? Is it something that you'd want to get into? Or is that more of a one on one conversation with people who are interested?

David Cain: 15:11

No, we're happy to talk about that. One thing that I am and our company is going to be is we're 100% transparent. So we are more than willing to have any conversation about the structure, what we're doing how we're doing it with any partner, because again, we want to make sure we have the right partners. And it's a two way conversation, you know, maybe we're not a fit for everybody, and they're not a fit for us. So we understand that. But to answer your question, $650 annually, is what we are is the upfront cost. And we offer if you wanted exclusive areas, it can be more than that. But it's based on population, but $650 as a starting point to get into our program.

Jason Muth: 15:57

$650 per year?

David Cain: 15:59

Yes, sir.

Jason Muth: 16:00

Yeah, and then all the rebates afterward?

David Cain: 16:02

Correct.

Jason Muth: 16:03

We've noticed I noticed there's a big hole in the northeast, I don't see any dots there. What's going on with your New England network?

David Cain: 16:11

Hey, we are aggressively looking for people in that area, that's for sure. All right, love to partner with any of your listeners in the area, or the two of you. Absolutely. We need some coverage in that area. Some people looking to give back to our heroes. Right.

Rory Gill: 16:27

Now, you know, another, you know, part of the this community that I think is, you know, important for me to understand and discuss. It's not just about, you know, financial needs or giving these rewards, but also a little bit about kind of their unique situations and the education that goes on with it, particularly members of the military, and veterans have a host of benefits that are available to them, that can get fairly complicated to understand. And this is true for other aspects of these is there an educational component or an educational network that you set up your data heroes, and also set up a professional so that they can, you know, more holistically and better serve all these clients?

David Cain: 17:08

Well, in the end, we believe that education is key. So we are constantly educating not only our partners, but trying to educate the general public as well as our heroes, because many of these heroes they have, well, multiple big corporations really kind of have, they're ingrained in the military community specifically. And they think that's the best option. But when you dig into the programs that they have, for the heroes, a lot of times those companies are, as a man, I'm not going to mention them, but they're essentially getting rich, off the backs of the military, when you look at what they charge and how they get paid. And the benefit they give back is really pretty embarrassing. So it is an educational component that we have to have. And that's why we're doing things like these podcasts so that the military understand, hey, nobody's going to give you more back than we will. We are here to serve and appreciate and recognize what you have done for us. And the money is going into your pocket. That's where the money's going not back into ours. Now, granted, we got to make money, of course, but to keep the lights on, but the vast majority of what we are our network is giving is going directly to the hero.

Jason Muth: 18:36

Have you been traveling at all to conferences or go into any real tour or related industry conventions as a way of getting the word out?

David Cain: 18:46

That's on the books. Yes. So we're looking at a couple of towards the end of the year, and we've had a couple people come back and tell us, hey, we were at a seminar or conference and your company was brought up. So the word is getting out there, which we're super excited about. But we're going to pour gas on that fire and see what we can do to to get the message out more. So absolutely. We're looking at some future conferences and seminars to help.

Jason Muth: 19:16

Right. Now, before you did this, you were a lender yourself. Is that right?

David Cain: 19:20

That's correct.

Jason Muth: 19:22

So it's a crazy real estate world that we're in right now here in 2023. Have you noticed any changes over the past, say 12 months of you being involved with this company? Like is there momentum in certain components of your industry and your business? Are you seeing? I don't know, what what do you see? Because, you know, we asked this question of everybody because, you know, we're all across the country and we're all seeing different things with, you know, mortgage rates as they are and inventory as it is, you know, what are some of your observations?

David Cain: 19:55

Yeah, so obviously 2020 and 2021. They're in the rearview mirror and long behind. So it's kind of a, you know, a new era so to speak. We're seeing significantly lower volume. There are more, you know, some buyers coming back into the process, but they are much critical or picky of the properties, seeing lots of people back out due to inspections. We also are seeing seller concessions, we're seeing, of course prices and most markets continuing to go up. Obviously, there are some exceptions to that. But prices are still steady and moving up in most areas. So it's, you know, a lot of people are thinking they're going to wait until rates come down. But I don't think that's the best move, because homes are still going up, and you're gonna be paying 5 to 10% more, when you look again, by the time rates come back down.

Rory Gill: 21:02

Yeah. You know, this program, we're talking about the value of homeownership and helping you know, those who serve the community be able to buy into the community, but I also want to ask about investor buyers, particularly in the military, I see a lot of really smart decisions made by service members who may live in one area for a while, buy a property, and then when they move to an end to investment property, rinse and repeat, and that builds generational wealth for their families. Is this program open to these heroes when they're transacting as investors?

David Cain: 21:33

Yes, absolutely. So it's not just for a primary residence. But in that particular situation, if they are PCS into another location, then that would be a primary residence. And they would be able to use bonus entitlement to get another VA loan. So it would apply to that, and, and for second homes or investment properties as well.

Jason Muth: 22:00

Okay, so if you're working with a hero of one of the five categories, who wants to purchase a home, would they start with you, and then you would refer them to a local team in their market? Or, I guess I have a two part question. Because I'm curious, if working with somebody as part of your network submitting offers, you know, as part of a Hero's Home Advantage team or something, you know, does that give them a leg up as a seller as considering multiple offers? Those are two kind of unrelated questions, but I wonder what the benefit is, besides getting rebates for a teacher or a soldier to be able to work through the program?

David Cain: 22:40

Yeah, so good question. So the first question, you know, it's kind of a two pronged approach, you know, our local partners in the different areas, you know, are generally marketing and promoting it within their area, they're also trying to, we're helping them talk with large hero groups, organizations, companies, and develop what we call corporate affinities, and offer this as a free benefit to all of their employees. So we're helping them with that on a like have kind of boots on the ground approach. We also were, as I mentioned earlier, doing national things to brand increase awareness and to help reach our heroes. So both of those approaches are, are occurring out in the marketplace. So if it's a local partner, and it's a boots on the ground, and they're probably going to reach out to that local partner first. Obviously, if it's national, then they're going to come to us first, or if they find someone on the map in their area, they could go there first as well. So it can happen many different ways. But the key is, they really need to start with either a hero partner, or with us first. Because once they start the process with a realtor, then in that scenario, most likely, they're not going to be able to get the lion's share of the credit. Now to your second question, I believe yes, it is a huge advantage when you're competing, because that's money that's not needed to be asked for closing costs, or that is money that they could utilize to maybe offer a little bit less, because they are saving that $5,000 or more. So I think it absolutely gives the leverage to buyers when they are working with us versus not.

Jason Muth: 24:39

Rory, do you see any situations I know like, what are they called sweetheart letters, you know, when you write a letter to the people selling the house, you know, please sell it to us. You're not supposed to do that. It's illegal in some areas, right?

Rory Gill: 24:52

I mean, I can just kind of speak for our jurisdiction and when you start to, there's a way to improperly use personal characteristics to, you know, pitch your offer, you know, above others, just for anti discrimination protections and other things. You do need to tread carefully and there we have several podcasts just on how to really walk that fine line. In the end, the stronger offer is going to win in these situations where you have a lot of close offers. Sure they're letting tangibles you know, having promoting somebody for their profession doesn't go afoul of any discrimination protections, kind of letting the buyer letting the seller know that this person is a teacher as a first responder in the community, there's nothing inherently wrong with that. You just need to be careful to make sure that it's not stepping in for something that's really improper and shouldn't be part of the decision making process.

Jason Muth: 25:41

Yeah, I just I just wonder if an offer that submitted where somehow Heroes Home Advantage is woven into that offer? I wouldn't I don't know how, and this is probably something, you know, we could think through afterward, how that could help that offer, strengthened, you know, beyond just monetarily, where the people that are making the offer can kind of move their numbers around, because they know they're getting some rebate, that's my question.

Rory Gill: 26:03

That's going to vary case by case to also, you know, if the seller understands that the potential rebate to mean that this buyer might be able to afford more that could also undercut your negotiating position, but really is going to be on a case by case. You know, property by property decision.

Jason Muth: 26:18

Well, perhaps they're questions for David's, you know, weekly calls, right? You know that you guys can kick around. David, why don't we get to our final couple questions, we ask of all of our guests on the podcast. And I'd love for you to tell everyone where they can learn more about Heroes Home Advantage, obviously, we'll put it all in the show notes as well. But we asked these of all of our guests that come on as a way of kind of tying things up and getting to know you a little bit more. There are really three simple questions. The first of which is if you can get on stage for half an hour and talk about any subject in the world, that does not have to be about your profession, what would that be?

David Cain: 26:53

That's a tough one. I would probably say just my faith because it has such an impact and has the ability to impact so many people around the world just in their day to day living and their relationships, how they work and operate, just their view of life and in others. So that's probably what it'd be.

Jason Muth: 27:16

I'm sure you can weave that into the work that you're doing right now. Because there's a service in both of those, those categories of conversation.

David Cain: 27:25

Absolutely. Yeah, they're definitely intertwined.

Jason Muth: 27:27

Yeah. Second question we have tell us somebody happened early in your life or career that impacts the way that you're working today.

David Cain: 27:35

I think probably probably the best things that have just go through self evaluation analysis through reading books, realizing that probably earlier in my career was more focused on how to hit certain goals and, and how to achieve certain things, as opposed to how to serve, and how to kind of empathize with people in their process of purchasing a home, and really realizing that, you know, if I serve people and help them in the way that that other people aren't, then the goals and everything else will will fall into place. And so, you know, not recognizing every situation as a transaction, but as an opportunity to help and serve and educate other people.

Jason Muth: 28:35

Yeah a lot of that comes with maturity and experience, you know, professionally. I've spoken about this before, but I think I have more empathy toward parents in the workplace now that, you know, we're parents instead of, you know, many years ago when I was a sales manager and did not have a child. Not like I wasn't empathetic toward people that had children at home. But, you know, I didn't quite understand what they went through if they were having a bad day at work. And that might have been a spillover from a bad day at home. Not that I was a bad or tough sales manager, particularly, but I get it. I mean, yesterday for us was a half a day, it was a snow day, we had a child at home for the half day, the previous week, I had a child at home for two days in a row with a fever. You know, it's like that kind of empathy. I didn't get it back when I was just showing up at work every day, Monday through Friday.

David Cain: 29:22

Yeah, I totally do. I have a whole new level of respect for working parents. I'm fortunate enough that my wife works kind of part time out of the house, and she's able to help with the kids. But there literally is something every week, whether it's a sickness, or seems like some kind of school holiday or day off, and I don't know how to working parents who have jobs in the workplace, they're not remote, how they do it these days. I really, really don't. And so I have been to sympathy for them as well.

Jason Muth: 29:56

I think empathy comes into, you know, the work that you're doing also with Heroes Home Advantage. You know, it's not just people that appreciate the work of the heroes that can benefit from your program. But certainly if, if people are near and dear to heroes, whether it's their parents that you know, served in one of these capacities, or sibling or kids or anything, I mean, you know, that's an obvious connection, but I think that you know, heroes and parents, all parents are heroes, for God's sakes. Right, but like your parents and heroes, I see a lot of similarities, you know, between this and I could see some of your people that maybe they decide to sample the program because their, their dad or their mom served, you know, as a fire person or you know, first responder or overseas and they wanted to give back. I just see so much, you know, commonality there. And a lot of that stuff just comes with maturity. Not that I was immature in my 20s and early 30s. But man, like you just, you need some life experience for you to really get this degree of empathy.

David Cain: 30:54

Absolutely.

Jason Muth: 30:55

Final question we have for you tell us something, anything in the world that you're listening to, or watching or reading these days?

David Cain: 31:00

Well, the book I'm reading right now that gets called, or success, dream or something along those I can't remember the name of it. It's actually by I believe his name is McDermott's last name. And he's actually from up in in the New York area. And he talks about his upbringing. Now he's CEO, I think of ServiceNow, maybe, but it's a fantastic book talks about his upbringing. And once he's done, you know, how he got to where he is, and his life experiences, work experiences, and how he has learned about relating and managing people. So it's, it's been a really good book, I wish I could remember the name of it, but it's, it's fantastic.

Jason Muth: 31:51

I'm sure if we hit Google will probably find our way there, you know, Google to figure out exactly what we're trying to say, Rory, what else do you have for David, any other final questions?

Rory Gill: 31:59

No, I just want to say that, you know, this strikes my interests for, you know, for my businesses, and we can talk about that offline. But it just important to me my business to make sure that the servant leaders we have in our communities can afford to be part of our communities. And no one of these programs is going to solve the problem. No one of these programs is going to completely alleviate the home affordability crisis we have in the country. But this is a nice step in that direction. So I'm really glad that we had you on today.

David Cain: 32:28

Well, I really, really appreciate the opportunity. Hopefully, it's beneficial for all of your listeners, and there's anything I can do to help, please let me know, I would be happy to help your listeners and anybody in your area in any way.

Jason Muth: 32:45

How can our listeners get a hold of you if they want to learn more about the program?

David Cain: 32:49

So the best place to start is the website, which is heroeshomeadvantage.com. We also are on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram. So all of those as well. And but definitely the best place to start is the website talks about how the program works. And you know, the different areas and FAQs. But if for some reason there's not a partner in that area, please don't let that prevent you from reaching out. Because we also have other networks that we can reach out to, even in areas that are not, doesn't have a proper partner represented. And one other thing I would ask is that, for any of your listeners, maybe that this doesn't apply, please share it with someone that it does apply. And that needs to know about the program. Please share the podcast with friends or families or maybe your Facebook groups that need to hear about our program. That would be a tremendous help for us and help us to get the word out.

Jason Muth: 33:59

Well, yeah, we love it when people share this podcast, and we'll doubly love it. If this one gets shared. We'll put all of your links in in our show notes along with your social media links. Yeah, if you've heard this, and you might not apply to you, but it might apply to somebody that you know someone that you work with, you know, please send them a link to this podcast and have them subscribe as well so they can get all this great information from us here The Real Estate Law Podcast and future episodes. But David, we really appreciate your being on the podcast. It's, you know, it's been a pleasure to get to know a little bit more about you and Heroes Home Advantage. We definitely wish you the best.

David Cain: 34:32

Thank you so much for having me on. And really, really appreciate your time and your listeners. And I certainly appreciate just the opportunity to get the word out and hopefully reach more heroes and partners. And I did find out the name of the book is Winners Dream.

Jason Muth: 34:48

Winners Dream. Rory, write that one down and Rory tell everyone where they can get help. Where can they get ahold of you as well, if they want to reach out to you?

Rory Gill: 34:57

You can find me at my real estate brokerage. That's NextHome Titletown, nexthometitletown.com. Or my law practice that's UrbanVillage Legal, urbanvillagelegal.com.

Jason Muth: 35:08

All right. And if you've enjoyed the podcast, we'd love it if you can give us a five star rating on iTunes or whatever platform you're listening. If you want to drop a comment in the comment field. We read all those. We also read all the emails if you want to email me, jason@nexthometitletown.com. We'll have a look at it. If you'd like to be a guest on the podcast, reach out to us and we'll take a look and see if we can get you scheduled. And if you want to reach out to David but feel intimidated, reached out to him directly for some reason, you can reach out to me and I will forward your message over to David. So that's it. It's been another great episode of the podcast. David, thank you so much for being here. Rory, as always, thanks for all your insight. And thank you for listening. Really appreciate it, and we'll see you next time. Appreciate it.

Announcer: 35:50

This has been The Real Estate Law Podcast. Because real estate is more than just pretty pictures. And law goes well beyond the paperwork and courtroom arguments. were powered by NextHome Titletown Real Estate, greater Boston's progressive real estate brokerage. More at nexthometitletown.com and UrbanVillage Legal, Massachusetts real estate counsel serving savvy property owners, lenders and investors. More at urbanvillagelegal.com. Today's conversation was not legal advice, but we hope you found it entertaining and informative. Discover more at the realestatelawpodcast.com. Thank you for listening