The Real Estate Law Podcast

40 - Navigating an Astonishing Seller's Market with Real Estate Broker / Owner Tory Keith

March 01, 2022 Jason Muth + Rory Gill Season 1 Episode 40
The Real Estate Law Podcast
40 - Navigating an Astonishing Seller's Market with Real Estate Broker / Owner Tory Keith
Show Notes Transcript

In this episode, we're speaking with another Boston-based real estate broker, Tory Keith, and figuring out together how we all should be navigating this astonishing seller's market that we are in!

Tory, a lifelong resident of Metrowest Boston, worked for a boutique firm before founding Board & Park, offering tailored comprehensive property solutions, from sales and brokerage for homes, estates, and investment property, to staging and interior design.

We share stories and compare notes about the insane market that we're seeing once again here in the Boston metro area, especially in places where Board & Park concentrates, like Newton, Natick, Needham, Wellesley, and Framingham.

In this episode, we talk about:
-- Running a brokerage
-- The current market for buyers and sellers
-- Challenges that agents are facing in 2022
-- New construction projects, including one of Tory's own investments
-- Changing brokerage operations due to COVID
-- How virtual tours have helped qualify open house attendees
-- Crowd control and safety at open houses
-- How Massachusetts has been a long-established and consistent real estate market
-- Investing for cash flow versus investing for appreciation
-- What are buyers not doing correctly these days in order to submit winning bids
-- Recruiting good real estate agents
-- Establishing and maintaining a company culture
-- Goal-setting and accountability culture

Get in touch with Tory:
Board & Park on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/boardandpark/
Board & Park on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/board-park
Tory Keith on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/torykeithrealestate/
Board & Park on Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/boardandpark
Board & Park website - https://www.boardandpark.com/

Fun fact - Board & Park is named after the Monopoly properties Boardwalk and Park Place (something that was not, but should have been, obviously apparent to Jason!)

Join Jason Muth and Attorney / Broker Rory Gill of NextHome Titletown and UrbanVillage Legal in Boston, Massachusetts for another episode of The Real Estate Law Podcast!

#bostonrealestate #sellersmarket #openhouses #realestatepodcast #nexthome #humansoverhouses #realestate #realestateinvesting #runningabrokerage #realestateinvesting #careersinrealestate #realestateagent
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Tory Keith:

I think a lot of them just don't realize the level of competition that they're going to face. You know, we have those upfront conversations about contingencies and being prepared to, you know, I hate to tell people to waive an inspection and I don't tell them to do that. But when you're competing for an investment property, bring the contractor before you make the offer, so that you can feel comfortable moving forward with your contingencies. Having their financing in place is always a big one.

Announcer:

You found The Real Estate Law Podcast, because real estate is more than just pretty pictures. And law goes well beyond the paperwork and courtroom argument. If you're a real estate professional, or looking to build real estate expertise, then welcome to the conversation and Discover more at realestatelawpodcast.com.

Jason Muth:

Well, hello, it's another episode of the real estate law podcast. Thank you very much for listening. I am Jason Muth and we're here we're doing a Boston episode today, or Massachusetts episode, I should say, you know, which we don't do enough of these, we should do more of them. But we are here with two brokers from Massachusetts, we have Rory Gill, our co host who's a attorney with UrbanVillage Legal and a broker with NextHome Titletown. And we are here with Tory Keith, who is with Board & Park, another great brokerage here in Massachusetts. And I think we're gonna be doing a lot of comparing of notes in this episode. And this is a great way to get a couple of the best minds who are running brokerages together. And let's see how we could both improve what we're doing. And you as a listener can take couple things from this. So welcome Tory. Welcome Rory. You know, I have a cousin Cory and my mother calls Rory "Cory" all the time. So now we have Rory and Tory and I didn't didn't occur to me until right now that. Maybe if this works out, well, we could have the the Rory and Tory podcast and I'll just bow out.

Rory Gill:

But perhaps I'll be sure to speak clearly throughout for those listening, obviously know who's talking who's talking about whom I'm really excited to be able to trade notes, trade impressions. And hopefully we disagree in a couple of things. So interesting for our listeners. But thanks, Tory, for joining us. You have a brokerage Board & Park in MetroWest, you're based in Natick, is that right?

Tory Keith:

Yes.

Rory Gill:

Tell us about your team in your office.

Tory Keith:

So right now, there's 10 agents, including myself, so we're small boutique brokerage, based out of Natick, but people cover everywhere, basically, from Worcester to the Cape. So the primary focus is definitely MetroWest area. But we do go beyond that also. Definitely been a little bit different since COVID. We're doing mostly virtual meetings, which I think has actually been kind of nice, it's easier for people to get to. And the majority, 7 out of the 10 agents are active real estate investors also, myself included, so made for some good connections between everybody and some good collaboration.

Rory Gill:

I'm embarrassed that we're having our first conversation now. Because you're seem like you're awfully similar to us. We're a little smaller, we have nine agents, including myself covering the Boston area with a couple agents who focus a little bit outside of Boston, and about half of my agents who are also real estate investors. So it's, it's a good culture. I think that that this is working out, too. You know, and you said, it's been a wild ride for the past couple of years. And I guess I'll start there, because it's an obvious place to start. What are your impressions of the market here in Massachusetts, and I can trade your mine. But you know, what was it like for you running an office from the moment, you know, we went from from normal life to COVID lockdown to hopefully post COVID? What was the journey like for you? Because I know it was it was stressful, and exciting at times for me.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, definitely. It's been a roller coaster, I think, you know, when COVID first hit, and everything really totally shut down. There was that moment of panic, where we all said, "Oh, my God, we're never going to sell another property because nobody's ever going to leave their house again." And it wasn't long after that. I think just a couple of weeks later, my first listing during COVID was a two family that had tenants in it. And, you know, that was whenever we it was kind of trying to figure out how to navigate all of this. And the day that we were beginning showings where we had all the precautions we thought possible in place, the tenant said I was exposed to COVID. And I don't know if we should do it. And then she says, I think I'm fine. But I want everybody that comes into the house to wear hazmat suit and a mask and gloves and you know, so we were able to kind of navigate that and turned into you know, the first of very, very many, multiple offer, you know, way over asking situations that we've had since then, as I'm sure you're experiencing too. It's just now still the lack of inventory that's driving the company the competition up.

Rory Gill:

We had just moved into our new office space. And we're getting ready to kind of announce a new office space in about March of 2020, which is pretty poor timing in our part. But you know, everything we had in the pipeline came off the board, and late March, every single transaction that we had, and many of them would come back later on, but for a few weeks, it was pretty, it was pretty sheer panic. And then things came back. And, you know, we had an unexpectedly great summer as a, you know, as a result, we had, you know, a lot of challenges, but part of it was we changed our operations and things and even when everything's completely done, are we at the all clear, I think there are a lot of practices that we picked up that I'd like to keep forever. I don't know about you, but a trite example, but open houses, when we started doing open houses, it became really difficult to manage the crowds in a way that, you know, we're not doctors, but we would perceive to be safer than others. But what started working for us is having two agents work an open house so that way, one can check everybody in, you know, answer the questions, and the other can be more available to direct people to the property. And that worked out better than we ever could have expected. And that's what we've been doing for not every but for a lot of our open houses since and it's something that I like to retain. Are there any similar situations that you have where you change your business model, but it actually turned out to work well for you?

Tory Keith:

Yeah, I think this is really similar to what you were just saying is, I typically will have a lender come in, a lot of my agents will do the same thing. So the lender can kind of act as the door person, and get people signed in and kind of manage crowd control. And usually, we have a line down the street these days. So just to regulate the number of people in the house. And that's worked really well. And I think, you know, that's something that will continue. It benefits the lender, it's nice for us to have somebody to answer their questions. And the other thing is just doing more of this virtual stuff that you know, in-person showings are back in full force the vast majority of the time, but now that people are so much more comfortable with things like video tours and stuff like that, I think it really makes our process more efficient. Because they'll look at things online, they'll look at our videos ahead of time, and then kind of narrow down what they want to see that way. So you don't get 1,000 people wanting showings have a property that you know, maybe isn't quite the right fit for them. They've kind of done their research. And they know what they're looking at in advance. So that's been that's been a positive for sure.

Jason Muth:

You know, talking about crowd control, can I throw another person in there, you might need to have security or police with the lines that you're seeing open houses these days? I saw somebody posted on Instagram this week, a video of a massive line of cars. And like it was like one of those quizzes that was like, Is this a line to get off the exit? Is this a line to get on into this open house? Second story literally like overnight, I was messaging somebody from our NextHome Instagram account, who posted a story how she she received a note back from the selling agent saying thank you for submitting the offer. We're reviewing them all, we had 90 offers. And I was like 90? And she said it actually was 100. And she said it was underpriced kind of dilapidated place, but everyone really wanted to buy it. But I'm thinking long lines down the street that people are posting a video to go to an open house and 100 offers on a property, like where are we going this year?

Rory Gill:

I mean, I suppose like that's a great problem to have when you're on the seller side. But it does come with its own challenges of how do you start to sift through 90 offers? And what does that mean about your marketing strategy, if you price it so low that you ended up with 90 offers? You know, it's probably not opportune, even for the seller to have to kind of sift through and do all of that much homework, you know, you you've kind of talked about crowd control, quickly, kind of a joke, but you know, we actually do need to worry about realtor safety out in the field. Fortunately, in Massachusetts, we haven't had one of kind of the deadly incidents that have happened elsewhere. But it's, it's a concern as people get ruder, the crowds get longer, you know, keep making sure that you know, our team is safe is pretty, pretty critical.

Tory Keith:

Good to have somebody else add an open house too. I always have told my agents you know, whether it's a lender or somebody else just having that second person both for the seller security and their own is a good thing.

Rory Gill:

But you know, keeping it local but maybe making a little bit cheerier. How would you? You know, I like the local conversation and I kind of see what you know, I I'm plugged into kind of where other brokers are seeing across the country and their perceptions about, you know, the Northeast versus the South. How would you describe how Massachusetts fits into the national trends? Are we a stronger market, a weaker market? You know, where do we fit in with the general real estate trends?

Tory Keith:

I think we're definitely one of the stronger markets and it's funny 'cause you do see some of these statistics that were losing population to places like the Carolinas. But, you know, based on what we were just talking about with these lines down the street, and 90 offers, the demand is there. And I think, you know, there's evidence of that, during even the last recession, that our property values held a lot stronger than they did in most other parts of the country. We have a lot of industry here, we have a lot of great things about being here. And I think, you know, that will keep the demand strong, and it's been a long-established market. So compared to some of these newer markets that have seen this explosion in prices over the last year or two years, you know, we have too, but it's kind of always been, you know, a solid market to be in.

Rory Gill:

You know, you're an investor as well. So you I mean, you probably kind of see it as you look around for investment opportunities. But I always say that we're boring market in some ways, we don't necessarily have the exciting climbs and falls. We're a little less volatile than some other parts of the country. Slow and steady wins the race. And some of our kind of underlying economic fundamentals are, are strong. And you know, early on in the pandemic, I would see other brokers in other parts of the country kind of triumphal about the narrative that people are leaving large metropolitan areas and traveling to cheaper markets for work from home. And outside of maybe some of that story being true for California, it's just not my experience on the ground. I still think that we're, we're still a good place to live, we still have a lot of opportunity, and we're, we're only getting stronger. I don't know if you agree with that or not.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, for sure. It's definitely been stable. And I know some investors in this area that will buy for negative cashflow, because it's just such a safe place to put money. And there's always that appreciation upside. That's, you know, it's never a guarantee, but certainly around here, it's a lot closer to one.

Jason Muth:

It's such a contrary to what we hear on a lot of podcasts. I don't know how how deep you go into the real estate podcast world. But, you know, since people are listening to this around the country around the world, other folks are always talking about the Midwest, Florida, Texas, you know, Sunbelt, all these other places that just behave differently from from Massachusetts. And sometimes we listen to that, you know, you mentioned negative cash flow, you know, but you're probably going to make the money on you know, a tax benefit on property appreciation on depreciation, all these great things. You know, everyone's saying you want cash flow, cash flow. I do agree with that. But, you know, yeah, it's a situation where maybe you're not taking a high cash flow opportunity on a deal if it's a great deal in the long term. It sounds as though that's, you know, something that you might subscribe to.

Tory Keith:

Definitely, yeah, my own investments have tended to be much more of a short term, rather than buy and hold, but I definitely see that and I've been sort of exploring some of these other markets because cash flow is appealing, but you stomaching that risk in terms of lack of appreciation? Or the opposite even? Yeah, not just paper depreciation, but the real thing. That's a concern.

Jason Muth:

Are you investing here in New England or would tell us about your investments?

Tory Keith:

Yeah, typically, I've done new construction or rehab single family residential for the most part, a couple of condo conversions, but close to home so try to stay in and around the Natick area, so just west of Boston, a little in Needham out to Holliston.

Jason Muth:

We've talked about our investments on this podcast a number of times. You know, we somehow found our way into the Airbnb space. You know, we have a little diversity we have some commercial we have a couple Airbnb is we have a couple being built. I think that was partly just picking an picking asset class and going with it, and partly by mistake. But it's worked out so far, you know, because it's great with cash flow. I don't know if you've done any, any short term rentals. But you know, we happen to pick a couple in appreciating markets that also bring money in so it's like it just hits all four - tax depreciation, cashflow, appreciation, quadrants, in our mind. We have not gotten down a road where it was a strict cash flow thing where the property value could have declined. But I know there's a lot of markets elsewhere that are like that.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, that's awesome. I have been starting to look into short-term rentals. Less so locally, just because of concern about regulation. I don't know if you guys have anything in the city or..

Jason Muth:

No, we have we have New Hampshire and Provincetown. So, you know, Ptown is interesting, because everybody rents there. I mean, it's just it's there are some there's about 3,000 or 4,000 year-round people who live there. But you know, it's a resort town, essentially, you know. The population swells in the summertime, I think renting Provincetown is a pretty common thing. So it's not like this is strange, but our other our other properties are in a town that is just not one that people are using rentingB but it's around the lake that people do rent in, you know, so like the local local micro community, they're used to having some, some renters. If they're vacationers or if their 12-month renters, it's not so out of line that we're doing it there. We're not going to plop one down in the middle of a residential neighborhood in Natick. Like that I don't think would work well with the people that have lived there for a long time.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, it seems to be the challenges with short-term rental regulation, or when they're taking what would otherwise be long term housing. So that sounds like it's working great, where you're in kind of these established markets, where they're really vacation areas.

Jason Muth:

Yeah, we had a great guest a couple episodes ago, Natalie Palmer that does a lot of work with Airbnb in California, Big Bear. And, you know, one of her criteria is, you know, take a point, try draw circle two hours around that point around any city, you'll probably find some vacation area, in that in that radius. And that's a place to look, That's kind of what we did.

Tory Keith:

That's an interesting thing. I like that.

Rory Gill:

For you and for your clients. What do you see as good investment opportunities right now, in a hot market in a densely populated area? You know, in a, in a blue state, with a high cost of living? What are some of the opportunities? What are some of the investment opportunities that you you're finding your clients are finding,

Tory Keith:

It's really hard right now to find anything. So it's, it's taking some creativity. There's not a whole lot in the past, it's been I've been able to find things on MLS, like the vast majority, I think of my investments have been from MLS, but in probably the last few years, more of them have been off-market. You know, so it's definitely helpful to have a lot of connections with other investors, contractors, attorneys, all of that you just never know where something's gonna come from. But yeah, I mean, it's, it's just kind of finding that property where the numbers work, and trying to avoid the temptation to bank on more appreciation to make the numbers work. I always try to underwrite things based on current value. And I know not everybody's doing that. And some people have done really, really well, the recent couple of years with, you know, really making their profits from a reno off of appreciation as much as anything else. So yeah, it's just, it's hard, it's taking a lot more effort to find those properties for the numbers work, but they're still out there.

Rory Gill:

I think, unfortunately, part of it is about who can find an investment opportunity right now. You know, if you own a contracting business, or a contractor, you may have more opportunities than some other people right now. Because you can do the, the forced value add. Or if you're somebody who is not new to investing, and you have the capital, and you know, you are making a play at the capital appreciation instead of the cash flow, then this might not be as hot market for you. But it's it's very challenging for a lot of the people that, you know, I try to work with the first time investors looking in for either, you know, small multifamily that they're going to live in like that. That's exactly that's been difficult, you know, neighborhoods that we service, you know, Dorchester Roxbury, South Boston, they've been those properties are going really fast for, you know, for prices that don't necessarily justify a cashflow-minded investment.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, I think that you know, what you just said about buying owner occupied multi for first time buyers that are open to an investment, that's my absolute favorite thing to tell them, because then you're not so worried about having this extreme positive cash flow situation, but they're putting themselves in a position where they're going to benefit from the equity appreciation of two-three units rather than just one. And it gives them so many more options when they go to sell or they want to trade up to that next property. And you know, the financing options for those are are pretty compelling right now too. But like you said, it is just hard to find them and we're seeing the same thing out in the suburbs, you know, there's not that many multi-families out here. So the ones that come on the market do tend to go really quickly, especially if they're in you know, decent condition that somebody could move into.

Jason Muth:

There's probably a generation of people that are getting into home-buying age or just starting to listen to Bigger Pockets and other podcasts out there where multifamily investing is, you know, such a big tenet of what everyone is talking about or has talked about for years. I mean, Bigger Pockets has just been around for so long. And there is a library of episodes about multifamily investing. So I think that a lot of people when they find them, that's the first thing that they look at and they say how do I get a multi and to your point in the suburbs, some suburbs I mean, like just northeast of Boston like in Revere, Everett, Lynn, Chelsea, those kind of areas. It's a little easier to find them but you know, MetroWest is a little more difficult to get out toward Worcester. What are some things that you like some some advice you can give to some people that are maybe looking for their first either residential property or investment property in today's climate that they're not doing these days, like, you know, you want to go find a home, what's missing from today's buyers?

Tory Keith:

I think a lot of them just don't realize the level of competition that they're going to face. You know, we have those upfront conversations about contingencies and being prepared to, you know, I hate to tell people to waive an inspection, and I don't tell them to do that. But when you're competing for an investment property, bring the contractor before you make the offer. So that you can feel comfortable moving forward with your contingencies, having their financing in place is always a big one. But what a lot of people don't realize is, you know, they'll say, Okay, well, I'm gonna buy this house and do a reno, and they don't think about financing the reno. And then lining up contractors ahead of time. But definitely having some flexibility to you know, if somebody is really dead set on, like, it has to be a 1950s, colonial, you know, with this exact floor plan on this street, and I'm not paying a dime more than 850 for it, well, you know, that's not going to happen. So they just have to have those priorities, maybe that are not negotiable, but other things they're going to need some flexibility with and just kind of being open to what they might be able to do to a property down the road. Because it's all about, you know, the potential that it has not necessarily the fact that the seller just put in a brand new kitchen. You can change the kitchen, you can't Slow and steady, I think I've found is a lot better change the street.

Rory Gill:

Yeah, yeah, no, there's another, you know, challenge in this marketplace. With the labor market being so tight, it's kind of finding and recruiting agents to grow the than sort of casting just a very wide net. Being a smaller office office and for finding the right agents to grow your office. How have you been going about growing your team the past few years? and really more of a hands-on broker, it's important to me that I really genuinely like the agents that I'm working with, and that it's the right fit. So that does make it hard, obviously, to narrow down who those people are. And that's okay. And slow is better than, you know, having one hundred people that are kind of floundering and not knowing what to do. So yeah, and people have options right now, with the labor market. There's people who may consider going into real estate from another industry, but they're getting offers from, you know, everything under the sun, because nobody can find employees anywhere. So it's being competitive as far as what I'm offering. I think, too. We have some unique commission structures and opportunities for agents that I haven't seen elsewhere. So I think that's helpful to them. And yeah, just just kind of finding those right people. That's great to hear, you know, slow and steady certainly does. I mean, I imagine this scenario, like, what if my office were to double overnight, what would I do and the truth is, I wouldn't be able to maintain the same, you know, relationship and onboarding with agents that I've been doing over the past few years, and getting them in there. And also just lose control of the the company culture. I mean, we're, we're a business where not every, you know, people aren't in the office 40 hours a week, nor should they be because that's not doing the job correctly. But there still is a team culture and an atmosphere that's more of an art than a science to establish. And, you know, every office is a little bit different. In our market, there are lots and lots of offices, I probably should have looked up the number before our conversation, but we have lots and lots of offices, and many good offices among them. And each office is a little bit different. And you're looking for somebody that fits your culture. And I also think takes advantage of the resources that that we've taken time to build up. As a broker owner, we, you know, we put our so much blood, sweat, and tears into building resources and tools and systems for agents. And you know, the ones that fit the ones and enjoy it are the ones to take advantage of all those and the ones that don't necessarily see value in your office are the ones that don't latch on. You know, we have a good number of people, I think, who listen, who are real estate agents and some brokers among us, you know, do you have any tips on how to build company culture and to maintain it?

Tory Keith:

Yeah, I think it is first having the right people. That's a big thing. And then just building those commonalities that they have. I we started off the new year where everybody set their goals for the year but shared them with each other and kind of committed to helping each other where they could, because we have an office where everyone comes from really different types of experience and backgrounds, it's not where you know, everybody's just kind of been in real estate, residential sales all along. Like I said, we have a lot of investors. So that's been helpful because everyone has these different perspectives where they're really able to be helpful to one another. So I think seeing people make those connections has made the culture a really positive one, you know, and some agents are more engaged in others, part of what I like is being able to offer a lot of flexibility where they can be kind of as involved or as uninvolved as they want, but run their business the way that they want to. But the ones that are the most engaged have really contributed a lot, I think, to each other.

Jason Muth:

Is there a certain type of person in your opinion, Tory, who maybe is not currently in the real estate world, but would be a great agent? Someone that's doing another job right now? Maybe you found some agents from other walks of life and said, you know, what you'd be really good at or have you ever considered doing a career in real estate? And, you know, I'd love to hear some comments on some other places, if people are listening to this, and they're running their own brokerage, looking for agents, you know, where are some places they could look in a non-standard environment?

Tory Keith:

Yeah, I have a couple of well, I've couple of my agents came from sort of not real estate backgrounds, and are doing extremely well, coming from sort of an operations role in the corporate world has been a really great transition. I've found that like, this particular one, I have to tell nothing. It's great. And a teacher, which, you know, teachers are natural leaders. They're very organized and on top of things, because they have to be. They can wrangle a classroom of kids. It's not so different from wrangling, you know, the clients in the home inspector and the attorney, and the lender and the sellers, agent and everybody else. So both of those have made have been good transitions.

Jason Muth:

Rory, what do you think?

Rory Gill:

I think the best experience I've had are from people coming out from outside of real estate, or those who have built up a lot of relationships within their field, that can be a lot of different things can be, you know, dog walkers. But where their livelihood is tied to keeping a lot of honest, good relationships over a long period of time. You know, I haven't had any people who maintain a client list that, you know, work in a barber shop, they know what it feels like to have to, you know, be top of mind for a lot of people and provide them good service, and people coming in from the service sector who've had a role similar to that I think transition pretty well. The substance of real estate is something that can be taught. But the ability to maintain relationships, is more of a character trait.

Jason Muth:

So Tory before you start to move toward our final questions, I'd love to hear a little bit more about what you're working on right now. You know, when we were chatting earlier, you mentioned that you were you just finished up a new build for yourself. And, you know, I'm sure this more things you have on the horizon this year. So what were some of your personal goals coming into into 2022, and where do you see yourself headed?

Tory Keith:

Definitely glad to have this particular project behind me, it was a new build that we kept. So it's for my own family, which was a whole lot harder than building for somebody else. So now looking for the next project or projects, which will probably involve some sort of local renovation, and hopefully a short term rental, that's a little bit less local. So that and then just recruiting, you know, a few more of the right people. I'm not looking to double in size over the next year, but you know, two to three more of the right agents that are going to be active and involved is kind of the goal for this year.

Jason Muth:

Yeah, I mean, manageable goals, I think are far easier than these lofty "I'd like to have 150 apartment units under my belt by you know, in 18 months." Like, it just seems so unrealistic. I think, you know, I've read a lot about goal setting, whether it's in real estate or not. And you know, you did something you said something earlier, which is that your agents, you know, said their goals to each other. And that's a great way to hold people accountable of those goals, you know, not, you know, in a punitive way, but if you speak it out loud to people, then it's not a secret you're holding yourself. You're telling other people what you're planning on doing. And then every so often in hallway conversations or Zoom meetings or in person meetings, if we're able to do those ever again. People could check on each other and say, "Hey, how's that project going?" You know, and then if you have no progress, you kind of have to uncomfortably say, Wow, I haven't gotten started on it yet, but I need to it gets you thinking, Okay, I I need to I'm being held accountable, even though If not going to have a penalty, somebody is checking on me, because I told them I was going to do this. So it's great that you have had your agents do that. And it does sound like your goals this year are very attainable, like, you know, slow and steady growth, find a couple more projects. Like that's just that's our mindset is to, you know, it's, Don't be unrealistic, like you don't have to shoot the moon this year.

Rory Gill:

What I like to do a tour is comment about having everybody share their goals is, it makes our jobs much easier if we understand what each agent is looking to do. You know, having a vague goal of you know, just selling as many as possible makes it really tough for us to provide the support and the guidance that they would need to build their business. And it's also important, I think, for us not to kind of impose our goals onto the agents. Some people come into the field for different very different reasons. But having them articulate what it is what they hope to do, whether it's in volume, number of transactions, or by some other metric allows us to, to work with them. And I don't know how I would without understanding their goals, I don't understand how I, you know, work effectively with an agent to help them grow.

Jason Muth:

So Tory, let's get into our final wrap up, where we asked the same three questions of all of our guests on the podcast, and we'd love to hear your responses. Our first question is, is a light one, if you were to get on stage for a half hour, and talk about any subject in the world with zero preparation, not real estate, what would that be,

Tory Keith:

I would have to go with traveling, I love to travel, and I miss it so much right now. So it's kind of all I want to talk about is where the next trip is going to be, you know, once we can more easily get around the world.

Jason Muth:

Where some of your more memorable trips been in the past?

Tory Keith:

Um, one of my big favorites was Iceland, which is funny because I'm always cold. And I always want to be somewhere warm. But Iceland was just really cool. You know, the scenery and the waterfalls were incredible. The hot springs. So that one was definitely up on the list. As was we took our kids to Paris when they were really, really little, and threw away the stroller in the airport and ended up having a three year old - I think they were three and five at the time - just kind of wander the streets of Paris and it kind of just worked out great and was really fun. And they still remember it. So that was awesome.

Jason Muth:

So Rory studied in France for a semester, right?

Tory Keith:

I did a semester in Paris. Yes, it's been. I didn't want to say how many years has been but it's been a long time since I've been to France. That sounds amazing.

Jason Muth:

We too, have been to Iceland, and it's one of the most fantastic places that you can vacation. If you're listening to this. And considering Iceland, like I give it seven thumbs up. It's just so breathtaking. Like it's like you're on a different planet in some places. Like it just it feels so different. I remember when Icelandair came into the Boston market, you know, it just was like Iceland? Like nobody - I don't I don't know about you. But it just wasn't on my radar until I started seeing all the marketing just over 10 years ago. And then I thought it was a cool place. It's a direct flight out of Boston. I mean, did you fly Icelandair when he went there?

Tory Keith:

Yeah, we did. And it's so close. It was so easy.

Jason Muth:

It's like I mean, it's an overnight flight but you I mean, the second you go to sleep you wake up and you're there. Like it's like a five hour flight like going there. It's crazy.

Tory Keith:

And if you go in the summer then it's never nighttime anyway.

Jason Muth:

Yeah, we went in March. So we the time of year we went the light was similar to here just shifted about an hour, it was like 7am to 7pm of light. But boy, those those eternal summers, right. So I'd love to go there in the summertime, where it's just always light.

Tory Keith:

Yeah, it was very light.

Jason Muth:

I don't know if I want to go there in the middle of December where it's always dark.

Tory Keith:

But Northern Lights.

Jason Muth:

You know what, and we tried to see them because it seemed the summertime but like we I have a camera that had long exposure that has a very faint green spot in the middle of it. So I technically saw them, but not not to the level that I should. The second question - Tell us something that happened early on in your life or career that is impacting the way that you're working today.

Tory Keith:

I think, you know, growing up, my dad always was adamant about telling me, you know, never worked for anybody else. He owned a business, still owns his business. And I think that really sunk in because I never really did except for a few like odd jobs, you know, high school college age. And I never really want to.

Jason Muth:

I don't think I've had that answer yet. Have we heard that? Yeah, that's a great answer.

Tory Keith:

Oh, that's a great answer that we haven't heard yet. Yeah. Third question.

Jason Muth:

What are you listening to or watching or reading these days?

Tory Keith:

Just read "Short Term Rental Long Term Wealth" by Avery Carl. So I'm starting to sort of explore the short-term rental world so that was good. And one of my favorite Mortgage Lenders just gave me "Disrupt or Die" by Jedidiah Yueh, something like that great book about marketing for the real estate mortgage industries. And so that was a good read to

Jason Muth:

"Disrupt or Die" - I have not heard that one. I'm gonna have to go check that one out. The Avery Carl book is good. Did you listen to that one Rory? No, no, I have not. But we do have a couple other episodes that we've recorded and Yeah, website is boardandpark.com on Instagram posted about short term rentals. So you know, there's a ton of stuff online. But you know, go check out some of the past episodes of this podcast if you haven't, Tory, and if you're under the same thing. Board & Park. And I'm also on Pigger listening to this also and have an interest in it, you know, we certainly have covered. We've over indexed The Real Estate Law Podcast in covering short term rentals up until this point, so we encourage other people that are doing short term rentals to contact us because we don't want to continue that conversation. It's just an ever evolving space. We've been doing it for five years. And you know, knock wood build systems get better in you know, there's always surprises. We have a frozen pipe. We get to go deal with it this weekend. But we caught it in time. Whereas the last frozen pipe we had we didn't. So Tory, thank you so much for joining us here on this episode. Can you tell everyone listening where they can find you? And we'll put all this in the show notes as well. pockets as well. We're Board & Park come from just out of curiosity, was it?

Tory Keith:

The name? Boardwalk?

Rory Gill:

Ah, yeah, I didn't see that. We're walking. Did you know that Rory like did I just walk into that one. I want to say I did. But I didn't. So yeah.

Jason Muth:

I didn't see. That's great. I love that. Oh, and the logo has a very Monopoly to it. All right. I see it now.

Tory Keith:

Yep. Monopoly. Are you a big fan? No huge fan. I mean, I've always played it always. argument with the kids. But it's a good lesson.

Jason Muth:

It is. Yeah. I mean, maybe maybe that's where I got my interest in real estate for many years ago. I always like playing with my parents and you know, I hated losing. Yeah, I'm sure a lot of the people listening to that can can attest. Rory, where can we find you?

Tory Keith:

You can find me at NextHome Titletown, that's nexthometitletown.com or UrbanVillage Legal, urbanvillagelegal.com

Jason Muth:

Instagram at nexthometitletownrealestate. And I'm Jason Muth and you can find me at Jason@nexthometitletown.com or just shoot us a message on LinkedIn or Instagram and I'll probably be the one that messages you back. So on behalf of Rory, Tory Keith thank you so much for joining us for this episode. It's been a lovely conversation. I've certainly enjoyed having you on I love having two brokers in the same market kind of sharing notes. It's been fascinating.

Unknown:

Thank you. Thank you.

Jason Muth:

Thank you for listening, everyone.

Announcer:

This has been The Real Estate Law Podcast, because real estate is more than just pretty pictures. And law goes well beyond the paperwork and courtroom arguments. were powered by NextHome Titletown, Greater Boston's progressive real estate brokerage. More at nexthometitletown.com and UrbanVillage Legal Massachusetts real estate Council serving savvy property owners, lenders and investors more at urbanvillagelegal.com Today's conversation was not legal advice, but we hope you found it entertaining and informative. Discover more at realestatelawpodcast.com Thank you for listening